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 Josh Barnett has emerged as a sensation in Japan since arriving in January, 2003. A former UFC Heavyweight Champion, few could have expected that Josh would, a year and a half later, be one of the top pro wrestling heroes in the country. Barnett devoted himself to learning pro wrestling the hard way, braving New Japan's grueling tour circuit, where he quickly began obtaining wins. Soon, he began representing New Japan in vale tudo fights, invading Pancrase successfully, and competing in fights on major New Japan events. Now a proud, respected member of the regular army, Barnett is out to prove professional wrestling's strength, and is hungry for success and titles. I had chance to interview Josh on many subjects, and his responses were very interesting. I can't thank him enough for the time and effort he put into the interview. Be sure to check out Josh's official site for regular updates on his career! Stuart: Your background has been pretty well documented. You were the youngest ever UFC Heavyweight Champion, and dominated the ranks there, with a near perfect win-loss record. What inspired you to get into mixed martial arts fighting? Was it a long-term plan of yours or a momentary thing? Barnett: I would have to say that I always had an interest in fighting, be it martial arts films or pro wrestling. I used to get into a lot of fights when I was young and was always rough-housing around. When I was a sophomore in high school, my brother-in-law showed me a tape of UFC 2 and I was hooked. I knew somehow, some way, I would try my hand at that. It was like watching a dream. So, obviously, once I got my chance it was a life altering event for me. Stuart: You were contacted by New Japan in 2002, making your first appearance in December at Nagoya Rainbow Hall and choking out Yuji Nagata, heating up your New Japan debut. And what a debut to have, headlining the Tokyo Dome! How did you feel to be given this chance, to hit the absolute highest stage of pro wrestling in Japan on day one? Barnett: I really felt that I had a big responsibility to give a great match to the fans. It didn't matter to me that it was my first time. The fans expected a main event caliber match. Stuart: You failed in your first attempt to win the IWGP Heavyweight Title against Nagata at the Tokyo Dome, but gave him a good fight and almost put him away several times. Were you happy with this match, and what was the experience of headlining such a huge show like? Barnett: Losing to Nagata wasn't something I felt ashamed that's for sure. He is an amazing wrestler, and the more I have got to know him, the more look up to him. I was a big mark for him in WCW, believe it or not. The match itself however, while a decent debut, didn't satisfy me in the least. I am a perfectionist and to this day I have yet to really be fully happy with a match of mine. I know I can do better. I had fought in many big events and shows before so nerves didn't factor in at all. Working at the first "Dynamite!" Show in front of 93,000, the UFC, PRIDE, these experiences are one of the key factors I think that I can pick up puroresu much easier than the average guy. I feel very comfortable in the ring or the cage. Stuart: It surprised many to learn that you would work most of the "FIGHTING SPIRIT 2003" tour right after your Tokyo Dome debut. But others knew that it was a dream of yours to wrestle in Japan, and this was your chance. At this point, you were an invader and subsequently only fought singles matches or teamed with fellow outsider, Perry Saturn. How was this tour for you? Was it as tough as wrestling in Japan is said to be? Barnett: It was very tough! The crowds don't just give you respect, you have to earn it. Not to mention wrestling with the top guys in the world every night takes its toll physically, as well as mentally. I can remember my first match with Chono and after eating a kenka kick to the face. I thought, "If I'm not on my toes there's gonna be tags on the end them". I can honestly say that it was a major step in my life and I spent every day training under Saturn, Chono, Curry Man, Barton, and Liger. To get all of those different points of view on wrestling was a tremendous advantage towards my learning. I am very lucky to have such great teachers. Stuart: When the tour was completed, how did you look back at it? Was it a learning experience for you, and what was your favorite match of the nine you were involved in? Barnett: It was definitely a learning experience and really, work wise, I am not very happy with it. To this day I am very hard on myself when it comes to my wrestling matches as well as my shoots. I guess for good match my tags against Nakanishi, but for me it was against Kakihara in Gifu. Stuart: One other question about that tour. Its common knowledge that you are a fan of the old UWF-I, and Masahito Kakihara was an up-and-coming star during the company's existence. You fought Kaki on 2/11 in Gifu as you said, and it was almost a throwback to UWF-I, stylistically similar. Was this match your idea or booked by New Japan, and were you satisfied with it? Barnett: I'm sure it was New Japan's way of saying, "We know you're a big UWF mark, so here, have fun." The style of the match was my idea, but Kaki was a big help. It was a lot of fun to work with one of the UWF-I superstars, but the match itself wasn't all that good. During the G1 we had a much better match and still, I know we could do even better. Stuart: It was a while until you returned to New Japan, and when you did it was at the Tokyo Dome in May, 2003. as part of the newly established "Ultimate Crush" route, a vale tudo fight against former King of the Cage star, Jimmy Ambriz. Suddenly, you were representing New Japan, carrying the company flag with you. What made you change your alignment from that of an invading outsider to a representative of the company? Barnett: I had never intended to be an "invader" in New Japan, and really, that's just something attached to any foreign wrestler. I love pro wrestling and really want to show its strength and revive what pro wrestling used to be. I enjoyed Muto/Muta in New Japan, but I think our interpretation of "prowres love" is completely different. To fight against the stigma that pro-wrestling is "fake" or "just a show" is one of my reasons for joining New Japan. I love MMA, but it is like a spoiled brat when it comes to owning up to pro wrestling. Without pro wrestling, MMA wouldn't exist. Still, I think pro wrestling in general has gotten soft and weak compared to its roots. Guys think that joining a puroresu company means now they can take easy and they don't have to work as hard as they used to. Pro wrestling used to be what the best amateurs in the world did. It was the highest order of fighting and wrestlers were regarded as the toughest men in the world. To treat pro wrestling as vehicle with which inside you work a gimmick is BS. People get tired of gimmicks and choreography. It was the feel of reality that made pro wrestling boom in the 70s, 80s, and the 90s. Somewhere in the 90s though, pro wrestling lost its heart and fire and started relying on gimmicks and moves to make matches. We need to change that method of thinking if we want to make pro wrestling #1 in the world again. Stuart: Along with Shinsuke Nakamura, you did New Japan proud by winning your fight and making sure the company had a positive win-loss record on the day. Your victory over Ambriz seemed to boost your popularity in New Japan, although it was hard to tell for a while, as your next visit wasn't for a couple of months. Did anything change for you in New Japan after you won this fight? Barnett: Well, I think people really sat back and said, "This guy says he'll crush any enemy of pro wrestling, and he means it." I remember that there was some worry about me facing Ambriz after they had seen him fight and saw his pictures. I told them, "He cannot beat me. I won't lose." And after all was said and done they knew not to doubt me when I stepped into the ring. Stuart: Your return to the pro wrestling circuit was for the closing stretch of "SUMMER STRUGGLE 2003" in July. Now as a New Japan representative, you teamed with trueborns like Takashi Iizuka and Koji Kanemoto, once again excelling with no losses at all. A big singles match on the tour came in Sapporo against Scott Norton to determine New Japan's top foreigner. In my opinion, this was more or less the perfect foreigner vs. foreigner heavyweight match. Did you see it that way, and how did you feel to inherit the billing of New Japan's top foreigner from a man who had held it for about a decade? Barnett: I didn't really want to become a foreign anything, and I still don't. Pro wrestling is without nations and boundaries. They don't play the Japanese national anthem as New Japan's theme, they have their own. Scott was a real challenge and a fast step-up for me. I knew he wasn't thinking about the title of "strongest foreigner" he just wanted to powerbomb my head through the ring. It was a very hard fought match for me, but very important, as it showcased my ability to come back when I'm down and my physical strength as I was able to use my suplexes just as effectively, regardless of his great size. It was my declaration that I was not just a regular foreigner, but that I was simply, New Japan. Stuart: The "G1 CLIMAX 2003" was next. You weren't in the tournament itself, but were a feature non-tournament performer against junior heavyweights for most of the tour. You fought some UWF style wrestlers, such as Kakihara (again), Naruse, and Minoru Suzuki (in a tag match). Any interesting stories from this tour? Barnett: I had the King of Pancrase match against Yuki Kondo at the end of the tour so in preparation, my matches with Naruse and Kaki were almost shoots. I also got the great opportunity to grapple with Minoru Suzuki, which was a great experience. He is just as slick as he seems in his matches. Every arena we worked I would sprint all the stairs before grappling. Then I would grapple for 45 minutes with a fresh guy rotating in. Liger, Heat, Goto (Hirooki), and others where a great help in my training. Stuart: The 2003 G1 Climax has been widely acclaimed for continuing to set the standard for heavyweight action. Did you get chance to see any of the tournament matches yourself? If so, what did you think of the tournament in general, and what were your favorite matches? Barnett: Hell yeah! I wouldn't have missed that for anything. It was great to be there and watch it all unfold, but there was a part of me that wishes I had gotten my chance to compete in it. I liked the Yoshie/Nagata match and even though short, Nagata/Shibata. I also enjoyed all the match-ups against Akiyama. Stuart: A couple of months before the G1, Chono told the media that he wanted you to be involved in the tournament itself, yet when the participants were announced, you weren't one of them. Were you disappointed by this, and would you like to be in the upcoming 2004 installment? Barnett: I was disappointed, but the office has its plans for me, and I know I'll get my chance. Maybe they felt it wouldn't be good to have a first year wrestler beating everybody. I hope I get a chance in 2004 and add another title to my collection, and earn my chance another shot at the IWGP. Stuart: There was another break before your return to New Japan, but in the meantime you occupied yourself by taking Pancrase by storm as a New Japan representative, and capturing their King of Pancrase Openweight Title. Your fight with Yuki Kondo was no easy one, but you managed to bust out a German suplex in it! What was this fight like, and did Kondo's heart and determination take you by surprise? Barnett: I wasn't surprised one bit by Kondo as I was very aware of how strong he was. I knew that no matter what he wouldn't quit unless I made him. I know that he will give Vanderlei (Silva) a very hard match this summer. As for hitting a "rolling German suplex", it was something I intended on doing. I really wanted to show that pro wrestling techniques will work in MMA and that they are very effective if used right. Now I am always looking to one-up that moment! Stuart: You still hold the Pancrase title, with no end in sight, given that you've conquered much of their upper tier. What are your plans for this title? Do you intend to keep defending it, or would you rather make PRIDE or K-1 your vale tudo priority? Barnett: I want to make a title run that will never be matched and be considered the King of all the Kings of Pancrase. Even if I fight in PRIDE and K-1 I will still defend the King of Pancrase. I won't just let go of such an important title. A real champion never would. Stuart: The "Ultimate Crush" route was abolished by New Japan late in 2003, with a return to "pure pro wrestling" shows. This has been a controversial issue, with arguments for both sides. Do you have any opinion on New Japan's move to keep all vale tudo fights involving it's superstars in other promotions? Barnett: It was expensive and lack of proper build up and names hurt the initial attempt. I think that it is good to go to the "enemies" ring and defeat their fighters like this last K-1. That will have to do for now until we can re-establish "Ultimate Crush" some day. As for returning to "pure pro wrestling", no company has done that yet. New Japan in forging the way but, "pure pro wrestling" is something that is on the horizon but not yet here. Stuart: Your final tour with New Japan last year was "BATTLE FINAL 2003", and was the first time you worked a complete tour. By this point, you had plenty of pro wrestling experience under your belt. Your positioning in matches was different than on your previous two tours, with many six man tag matches as part of the regular army. How did this tour compare to your others, and what were your favorite matches or experiences from it? Barnett: By this point I really started to feel comfortable in the ring after working with the top guys in many matches. It was also a blessing to have been able to work with those veterans when it came time to do six man tags for my first time. Their teaching made it much easier than it could have been. Every match with Iizuka was great because I could feel our team getting more and more in synch with each other match. If we were able to keep working together I don't know who would have been able to beat us. The re-match with Norton was a great one which no one will get to see. It's a shame, but I think it went better than the first. Man, that guy will put you through the ring! One interesting thing was that against: Tadao Yasuda, Mitsuya Nagai & Ryushi Yanagisawa in Shirakawa, Yasuda got more than he bargained for. I got a tag and came in cleaning house and Yasuda thought to come in, but mid-way between the ropes, he must have had a change of mind because he stopped, straddling the second rope. Well I wasn't stopping and, WHOP! That sound travelled throughout the whole house followed by a large, "Ooooooohhhhh...". Yasuda had just eaten a left kick flush to his face and he spun, hanging on to the rope, and fell on to the apron, then outside. Hoshino runs over and wakes him up and he must have seen stars and tweetie birds because he kept shaking his head and blinking. The next day I see him at the next arena and his top lip is 3 times its normal size. He looked like Donald Duck! Stuart: There was no break for you after the fifteen show tour concluded, with a major double header in the form of "INOKI BOM-BA-YE 2003" on New Year's Eve, then New Japan's traditional January 4th Tokyo Dome show to kick off 2004. First of all, you had to fight Semmy Schilt for the second time in your career. You had virtually no time to rest up after the New Japan tour, but still managed to defeat him in a really physical fight. Did the lack of time to fully prepare for this fight effect your performance at all? Barnett: I can't really say and at this point, to me, it doesn't matter. I can't complain about anything in regards to that fight because I am a pro wrestler, and good or bad, if the fans like it, it's good. I did get food poisoning a week and a half out from the fight and lost 7lbs, but it did help my abs! The fact that I did do a tour, train, fight, and win proves that pro wrestlers are the strongest. We face the toughest schedules and the odds against and still come out on top. Semmy also made the fight tough by gaining 30lbs from our last fight. He was much stronger than before and at 7'+ and 286lbs (now 300lbs in PRIDE), with a lot of skill, anyone would have a tough fight with him. I expect him to be a force in the PRIDE GP this year. Stuart: A related question that many fans ask, but would surely love to hear the feedback of a wrestler. Do you think it's unreasonable to expect New Japan wrestlers to perform well in vale tudo fights, given the hectic schedule they have to contend with? For example, Nagata had next to no time to prepare for his fight with Fedor, one of the world's best, and took the match at a few days notice. The result was a fairly convincing defeat for one of pro wrestling's top stars, but had he been given months to prepare for it (a near impossible thing for a pro wrestler), he may have presented a tougher fight for Fedor. Any thoughts on this debate? Barnett: As a fighter I know what it takes to be at the top, and you need that kind of preparation to be at your best. Many of the wrestlers have great potential but have not had time to hone it and haven't performed at their best. Nagata-san knew what he was getting into, but he said to me, "I'll fight Fedor and I'll win.". When I looked into his eyes I could see that he meant what he said and would do his best for New Japan, even if he bled for it. I have a lot of respect for him and I did my best to help him win. This time it wasn't enough though. Stuart: Despite the vicious fight against Schilt, you marched on to "WRESTLING WORLD 2004" earlier next year at the Tokyo Dome. You teamed with Iizuka against Kazunari Murakami & Katsuyori Shibata in a grudge match between New Japan and the Makai Club. This was your second pro wrestling match at the Tokyo Dome, one year to the day after your debut. How did the experience differ from one year ago, and also was this Josh Barnett a different pro wrestler than the one who faced Nagata? Barnett: Well, I felt better prepared for this match and really wanted to establish myself as a "true pro wrestler". I knew much more about building a match and getting the crowd behind you. I thought the match went well, but with every match of mine, I felt that I could still do much better. I always have something to work on. By this point I was a different fighter. I was a New Japan wrestler. Stuart: You've become very popular with fans now, and most are waiting for the day to arrive when you establish yourself as one of the absolute leaders of Japanese pro wrestling. Your evaluation rate on the 1/4 Tokyo Dome show, as voted by fans, was a staggering 95%+ positive. Are you surprised by just how popular you are becoming in Japan, and do you feel that New Japan supporters accept you as a true New Japan representative now and not an outsider like many foreigners are? Barnett: To say the least, I was shocked. Liger and I were sitting backstage and we were watching the ratings on the TV. Liger's rating came up at 83% and I started teasing him. Telling him, "You're the man. You stole the Dome show.". His face was all lit up as the "champion" of the fan voting when my name came up and his jaw dropped. Hell, we both sat there stunned! I have to thank sensei Liger for that rating. I hope to be an absolute leader in the pro wrestling world. I want to leave my mark and inspire others to reach their ultimate goals as well. Like Inoki, Maeda, Takada, and others have for the fans. I do now feel like the fans have accepted me as a true New Japan wrestler, even though I didn't go through the system. Many fans express how much they want me to lead the way and show a strong example in pro wrestling. I hope to never let them down. Even though there's that one guy on your board who thinks I don't "belong in a wrestling ring", I feel much loved by my fans. That guy is alone in his opinion. Stuart: You've no doubt had chance to interact with most of New Japan's wrestlers backstage. How does the atmosphere backstage in New Japan strike you, and who would you consider your closest friends out of the wrestlers? Barnett: It's like I said to Enson, "It's a family in this office.". We get along, we bicker, I'm sure some fight with each other, but we all sit together at the dinner table. Backstage has been a wonderful place to be for me. Every tour I train with the wrestlers and train them as well. Liger, Kanemoto, Asami (referee), and many of the young lions are my regular students. Nagai and Naruse also a big help with teaching wrestlers how to shoot. Out of all of them Liger is my top student and it impresses me how much he improves with each tour. As for closest friends, well, we are all friends, but I seldom go out as I am always training. I do consider many of them good friends and it's not fair to pick any one over the other. Guys like Norton and Liger has been like mentors to me, while Kanemoto, Takayama, Nagata, Suzuki, Nagai, and Naruse have been really great guys and great to work with. There are also guys like Nakanishi and Iizuka who don't always have much to say but are perhaps the most pure hearted, honest people you'll ever meet. I would give blood for a guy like Iizuka, and I miss him a lot on tours. He was my partner and one half of the "Shinnichi Submission Soldiers", or "S3" as I named us. I hope that some day he'll return and we will tear up the tag-team scene. Stuart: Outside of the ring, have you had any interesting experiences in Japan? I recall you running New Japan's Toukon Shop a couple of times, and I imagine things like that are cool experiences for you. Barnett: Every day in Japan is a cool experience for me, and I mean that. It's like going through the looking glass and landing in Wonderland. I have great friends and great fans that make every day a surprise. One standout was when friends of mine through the internet - Gryphon, Dragonhead, Circus, Kumita-san, and others - all took me deep toy shopping in Tokyo. It was an amazing time that has to be repeated. Training under Billy Robinson has also been a wonderful time and I find myself learning so much that I chomp at the bit to go back and see what else he has to show me. Meeting the creator and artist of Hokuto no Ken (Fist of the North Star), Tetsuo Hara, was like a kids dream come true. It was something I won't ever forget. I get to meet so many great people that to talk about them would just be name dropping. It wouldn't do them justice and I am happy to meet so many cool people. I do have one uncool experience and that was having Tenzan take me and "The Shadow" to a Korean BBQ. That doesn't sound bad at all but when Tenzan order "squirming", freshly-chopped-off-a-live-octopus, sashimi it tends to make your stomach dance. I have never had to literally "wrestle" my food off my plate as it was still suckering to the dish only to have it sucker the inside of my mouth. It took so long to get the fortitude to eat it that the shock of then having to fight it was almost enough to make me pass out. Shadow got lucky and his didn't sucker punch him in the mouth. In the end though I did keep the belt and that octopus never got to get me back for eating him. HA! Tenzan, next time we'll just get the kalbi. Stuart: There are countless possibilities for you in Japan now. Dream matches both in the pro wrestling or vale tudo ring are constantly discussed. Barnett vs. Sapp, Barnett vs. Fedor, Barnett vs. Cro Cop, Barnett vs. Vader, Barnett vs. Chono, Barnett vs. Kobashi, and so on. Out of all the possible fighters in any combat type, who would you like to face the most? Barnett: Of all those, I think Cro Cop and Kobashi are the most interesting to me. Cro Cop, because he's supposed to be the "Puroresu Hunter" and that is a name that I can not allow him to keep. It's insulting to the whole pro-wrestling community. Kobashi, because he has the strength of the fans and is at the top of his career right know. I want to know if he can trade chop for kick and suplex for suplex with me. Who would walk away and who would go on a stretcher. Vader and Chono are legends and would make excellent matches, but they aren't in their top forms, and a younger champion like me beating them wouldn't carry the same weight. Sapp is my former student, and when he had the IWGP it was a matter of pride to take it back, but after his defeat and giving the title back I don't have any reason to fight him. Fedor to me is something that doesn't need to be thought about, it will just happen. Same as Noguiera, we will meet in the ring some day, and when that day comes pro wrestling will be supreme. Stuart: You haven't challenged for a title in New Japan since your debut match against Nagata. With only a couple of direct losses to your name, and countless wins, you are surely in contention for any title in the company (except the junior ones, of course!). When do you think you will be given a shot at the IWGP Heavyweight or IWGP Tag titles, and if you challenge for the latter, who would your ideal partner be? Barnett: I can't really say when my chance will come again to challenge for the IWGP, although I really believe that after all title changes it needs a real champion to hold it and I could be that champion. The IWGP is the highest belt in the wrestling world and it needs to be treated as such with a strong champion, not an invader and not a young "comeback kid". I want my shot to prove what I say, and put the belt back on top, just like I did with the King of Pancrase. If I don't get the shot, I still have a very important duty as the King of Pancrase, and that alone is good enough for me in the end. It's the fans who would lose out. Of course if I was take the IWGP Tag Team Title, it would have to be with Iizuka. S3 would cripple the competition. Stuart: Antonio Inoki is the god of fighting in Japan, and has fully endorsed you, even calling you the "ace" of New Japan on more than one occasion. Having had chance to meet this famous legend, what are your thoughts on him and his visions for pro wrestling in Japan? Barnett: I've never heard him refer to me as the "ace" of New Japan, but if he did it means a lot coming from him. He is someone I look to for advice and an example of what wrestling should be. There is a reason why people feel the way they do about him. I have met him on several occasions and I have to say that I always try to take something away from each meeting. We have a similar view on what pro wrestling is and should be. Shoot and work is the same and without understanding one, you cannot fully comprehend the other. Trying to show a "fight" without really knowing what fighting is ends up in nothing more than a dance. And what's the point of watching those who are supposed to be "fighters" and "tough guys" if the really aren't. It's more about concepts and understanding than anything else. Inoki and the New Japan stars from his era all made themselves and pro wrestling so over, because people could feel those matches. Even the argument that "Those fans didn't know about works yet" doesn't sit because people know movies aren't real yet they can be drawn into them all the same. Suspend belief and make them feel like what they are seeing is real and you have an unbeatable product. Stuart: Theoretically, if New Japan was to ever withdraw it's wrestlers from the vale tudo scene, do you feel that your position with the company would change? Would you be able to devote yourself to strictly pro wrestling? Barnett: Well the way I see it I am doing strictly pro wrestling. It's all one in the same to me, with just minor changes. I mean no matter how you look at it its people fighting for the entertainment of others. It's that simple. And for me it's all part of proving what I believe in. I can't imagine New Japan ever abandoning MMA, as it's ingrained in the fighting and entertainment culture in Japan. Pro wrestling is part of that and I think that we have to show the New Japan is King of Sports, and we'll take on anyone who challenges that. Stuart: Japanese wrestling is still virtually an underground thing outside of it's native country. The community in the west is still a mass of tape trading, internet discussion, and remains quite obscure despite slow growth. Do you think there is a market in America (or elsewhere) for New Japan as it stands, or would the company need to run more "America friendly" shows with the likes of yourself, Hulk Hogan, and Scott Norton headlining? Barnett: Having American talent on the show is always going to be a must but I really believe that New Japan has a great product that can work anywhere with the right scenarios. But, just based on the wrestling and talent alone I know we could be successful anywhere on the planet. Stuart: This is a question that many are intrigued to hear an answer for. In ten years from now, do you envision yourself as a representative of New Japan Pro-Wrestling, or do you think you will have moved on to other things by then? Barnett: I hope to be a permanent figure in New Japan's future and that my name will stand out as one of New Japan's greatest. To me this is something you don't just "move on" from. Stuart: What are your plans for the near future? Are you expecting to return to New Japan for any upcoming tours, and do you have any fights in Pancrase or elsewhere on the horizon? Barnett: I have a fight defending my King of Pancrase title in Seoul (South Korea) on July 17th, and I really hope to work the G1 this year. This will be Pancrase's first ever show in Korea, and it will be a big affair with me headlining, so I'll have to bust the "rolling German" or something equally spectacular. This will also be my third defense in what I intend to be long reign as King of Pancrase. Stuart: You have many fans outside of Japan, and convincingly won the "Foreign MVP" in my site's awards for 2003. Do you have a message for the readers of Strong Style Spirit? Barnett: I have to thank you all for such a great honor in only my first year of wrestling. I hope not only repeat that this year but be twice the wrestler I was last year. Thank you for all your support. Stuart: Finally, some word association. Your thoughts on...
1. Masahiro Chono - Mr. Cool. Excitement through charisma, not moves. Boss-man.
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